I was contacted about a the below inactive .pdf Is there someone in the group that can supply me or this person with the correct file?
Buenos días, perdón que lo moleste.
Ví en la página de Nuestros Ranchos un enlace al pdf del libro Andariegos y pobladores: Nueva España y Nueva Galicia pero el enlace ya no sirve.
Usted tendrá el PDF?
Muchas gracias, le envío un saludo cordial.
thanks,
joseph
There were four men, all named Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava, who were born around 1625-1630, and who lived in the Teocaltiche/ Mexticacan/ Nochistlan area. I have been sorting through various documents, trying to get a hold on who these 4 persons were, and whether or not they might be the same person or persons, and I’ve developed a couple of theories which I thought I’d share here. First, a breakdown on who these men were:
Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava #1
The first Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava married Catalina Cortes de Sandoval on 21 Jun 1651, in Nochistlan; they were velados the following 1 Jun 1652. According to the dispensation of Joseph de Luna and Maria de San Juan Jimenez, Mateo #1 was the son of Antonio de Rubalcava (#1), who was the brother of Lorenzo de Rubalcava, who was the father of Agueda de Rubalcava, great-grandmother of the bride: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-D28K-Z?i=481&wc=3JW5-V…
From other records, we know that Antonio #1 and Lorenzo de Rubalcava were sons of Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geronima Morales.
This relationship is confirmed by the IM of Eugenio de Rubalcava and Maria Dolores de Lizarde, which again establishes Mateo #1 as the son of Antonio de Rubalcava #1, who was brother of Lorenzo de Rubalcava, who was father of Blas de Rubalcava: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939N-TT37-2?i=25&wc=3P92-3T…
Mateo #1 died some time before 7 Jul 1670, when his daughter, Melchora de Rubalcava, married. Also, it should be noted that his mother is never mentioned, so her identity remains unknown.
Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava #2
The second Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava married Cecilia Vasquez de Islas on 4 Feb 1658 in Nochistlán; he died 21 Jun 1710, in Nochistlan. His origins remain uncertain; the only clue I’ve seen is the dispensation of their son, Joseph Gonzalez de Rubalcava, for his marriage to Magdalena Carrillo, hija natural of Geronimo Carrillo and Magdalena Mendoza. According to this dispensa, Mateo #2 and Geronimo Carrillo were 1st-cousins, though the details of their relationship are not explained: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-6K99-JY?cc=1874591&wc=…
Geronimo Carrillo might be the same who was married to Maria Lozano Sandoval, and who died and was buried on 8 Mar 1693 in Nochistlan. Likewise, he might be the same Geronimo, son of Diego Carrillo and Maria Lopez, who was confirmed 29 Dec 1666 in Teocaltiche: (left) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-QT5Y-7?i=46&wc=SS5B-7M… and who was living in their household in the 1681 Teocaltiche padron: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89K2-Y8HH?i=475&cat=23…
If this is the case, then Geronimo’s relationship to Mateo #2 could be through his mother, Maria Lopez de Rubalcava, who was the daughter of Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geronima Morales; since Mateo #2 was his 1st-cousin, then he would also be their grandson. The relationship would look like this:
Tronco: Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geronima Morales
Maria Lopez-1- ?
Geronimo Carrillo-2-Mateo de Rubalcava #2
Magdalena Carrillo-3-Joseph de Rubalcava
Note: it is clear that Mateo #1 and Mateo #2 are NOT the same person, since they were married to different women and having children at the same time, and also, the former died at least 40 years before the latter.
Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava #3
The 3rd Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava was the son of the above-mentioned Lorenzo de Rubalcava and Catalina Gonzalez, confirmed on 16 May 1634 in Teocaltiche: (right) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-QT5Y-9?cc=1874591&wc=3…
Mateo #3 had a natural daughter named Catalina Gonzalez, who married Juan Gonzalez Hidalgo on 31 Aug 1667, in Teocaltiche; that she was his daughter is explained in the dispensation of Bernardo Lopez de Nava and Quiteria Jimenez, which claims that, “Mateo Gonz de Rubalcava and Agueda Gonz de Rubalcava were siblings; from Mateo came Catarina Gonzales por copula iliicita, from whom came Nicolasa Gonzalez Hidalgo, mother of the groom; from Agueda came Catharina Arellanos, and from this one, Antonio Jimenez father of the bride”: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-6K9Y-JN?i=253&wc=12512…
From other records, we know that Agueda de Rubalcava aka Agueda Lopez was the daughter of Lorenzo de Rubalcava cc Catalina Gonzalez, supporting that Mateo #3 was the same confirmed in 1634. Nothing else is known about him.
Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava #4
The 4th Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava is mentioned in a Tierras y Aguas document dated 19 May 1653, in Teocaltiche: Antonio Gonzalez de Rubalcava (#2), resident of the estancia de Tepusco and widower of Juana Lozano de Isla, is taking possession of some lands left to him by his deceased wife - and which she had received from her maternal grandmother, Juana Navarro - along with some lands that the same Juana Navarro had left for his and his wife’s children, Mateo de Rubalcava #4 and Petrona de Isla. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSDL-6S99-B?i=200&cat=…
Confirmed on 6 Jan 1654 was Juan, son of Antonio de Rubalcava and Juana Lozano, padrino Miguel Martinez: (right) https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-QT5L-B?i=35&wc=3JFC-VZ…
TWO THEORIES
My first theory is kind of obvious: two men named Antonio Gonzalez de Rubalcava, and both with sons named Mateo Gonzalez de Rubalcava? They had to be the same person, and therefore, Mateo #1 and Mateo #4 were also the same person. This would establish that this Antonio de Rubalcava was the son of Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geronima Morales, and that Juana Lozano de Isla was the mother of his son, Mateo de Rubalcava (she herself was daughter of Pedro Lozano cc Petronila de Isla, and maternal granddaughter of Benito de la Isla cc Juana Navarro, as outlined in the above-mentioned Tierras y Aguas documents; Juana Navarro was daughter of Martin Navarro cc ?).
As for Leonor de Lizardi, does anyone have any proof that the Antonio de Rubalcava (#3) who died on 23 Feb 1682 and who was married to Leonor de Lizardi (who died 3 Dec 1679), was the son of Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geromina Morales? Or is it still presumed? Even if he were the same Antonio de Rubalcava, this timeline would work: he could easily have married Leonor de Lizardi after the death of his first wife (this timeline would also allow Leonor de Lizardi to be the same who was married to Juan de Sepulveda).
My second theory is that Mateo #2 and Mateo #3 are one and the same. This would explain what became of the latter, and it would correspond with the kinship given in the dispensation of Joseph de Rubalcava and Magdalena Carrillo:
Tronco: Mateo de Rubalcava cc Geronima Morales
Maria Lopez-1- Lorenzo de Rubalcava
Geronimo Carrillo-2-Mateo de Rubalcava
Magdalena Carrillo-3-Joseph de Rubalcava
The timelines, the names, the places, the relationships - all of the pieces fall neatly into place. Of course, these theories need to be supported with more documents, including any confirming that Antonio de Rubalcava #1, 2 & 3 are the same person, and that the above-mentioned Geronimo Carrillo was the son of Diego Carrillo cc Maria Lopez.
Please share your thoughts - and any documents that might support or contradict any of this. ;)
Saludos!
Manny Díez Hermosillo
PS - The 1681 Teocaltiche padron has an Antonio de Robalcava, widower, as head of household, and living with him was Juan de Robalcava mestiso. Was he the same married to Juana Lozano, who we know had a son named Juan? Or was he the widower of Leonor de Lizaldi, who died 2 years before? Or both? https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89K2-Y8QV?i=482&cat=23…
on this page of family search: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939J-4VSW-LB?i=161&cc=1804458&lang=en
child is Je Bernabe of Blas Palacios and Prudencia Guerrero (right side first complete record)
I'm trying to figure out the Abuelo Paterno first name of . . .is it ???Hoquinto??? Palacios and Micaela Reyes (see the attached snip)
thanks,
Joseph
Researching possible relative Juan de Saavedra in 17th century Lagos, and I ran across the de Saavedra y Guzman family, Basically, the below pedigree is cobbled from different sources. In some cases, I found this family group in online trees with the addition of my Juan de Saavedra and his wife Maria de Villegas:
PEDIGREE 1
1 Antonio de Saavedra Guzmán (Espanol) (c.1562-c.1620)
m. Catalina de Villafañe y Alvarado
1.1 Juan de Saavedra y Guzmán (birth estimates range from c.1589/c.1590)
m. María de Monroy y Flores (birth estimates range from c.1590 to c.1633)
1.1.1 Juan de Saavedra (Espanol) (birth estimates range from c.1590 to b.1634 and most dates for death are c.1675)
m. María de Villegas alias de Rodas alias Gonzales (Espanola/mestizo) (b.????)
1.1.1.1 Ana Saavedra (b.1651)
1.1.1.2 Ines Saavedra (b.1653)
1.1.1.3 Juana Saavedra (b.1654)
1.1.1.4 Josepha Saavedra (b.1660)
1.1.1.5 María Saavedra (abt.1663?)
1.1.1.6 Juan Saavedra (b.1664)
1.1.1.7 Phelipe Saavedra (b.1664)
1.1.1.8 Santiago Saavedra (b.????)
1.1.2 Isabel de Saavedra y Monroy (most online dates of birth are around c.1633)
m. Ines de Brenes y Mendoza (birth dates are again all over the map, usually c.1610 to c. 1622)
1.1.2 Isabel de Saavedra y Monroy (some pedigrees place Isabel as daughter of Ines de Brenes y Mendoza)
The proven pedigree I researched below belongs to another Juan Saavedra. It is based upon this Juan de Saavedra's marriage record and the baptism record of his daughter, María:
PEDIGREE 2
A Juan de Saavedra (b.????)
m. ????
A.A Juan de Saavedra (Espanol) (b.????)
m.1633 Ana de Quesada (b.????) (daughter of María Alonso)
A.A.A María de Saavedra (Espanola) (b.1634) - Padrinos: Domingo Basques and Maria Basques
Note: I saw an online pedigree on geneanet.org identifying Ana de Quesada with Ana López De Quezada y Mendoza, daughter of Alonso Diaz de Quezada and Juana Bautista Sanchez de Mendoza. In 1637, Juan de Saavedra and wife, Juana Lopes, served as padrinos in the baptism of Gertrudes Hernandes Xuares. If the Juan de Saavedra (A.A) of Pedigree 2 and the Juan de Saavedra of this 1637 baptism are the same person, that would lend credence to the idea that Juan de Saavedra (A.A) married Ana López de Quezada y Mendoza.
Since Juan de Saavedra y Guzman (1.1) from the online Pedigree 1 was likely married to Ines de Brenes y Mendoza during the 1630s, he cannot be Juan de Saavedra (A.A) from pedigree 2, who is clearly too old to be the Juan de Saavedra (1.1.1), who married María de Villegas and produced children into the early 1670s.
I inserted Juan de Saavedra (A.A) from Pedigree 2 into Pedigree 1, resolving the age gap between 1.1 AND 1.1.1:
REVISED PEDIGREE 1 (with guessed ages in bold)
1 Antonio de Saavedra Guzmán (Espanol) (c.1562-c.1620)
m. Catalina de Villafañe y Alvarado
1.1 Juan de Saavedra y Guzmán (b. c1589)
m. María de Monroy y Flores (b. c1590)
1.1.1 Juan de Saavedra (Espanol) (b. c1610)
m.1633 Ana de Quesada (b. c1610) (possibly Ana Lopez de Quezada)
1.1.1.1 Juan de Saavedra (Espanol) (b. c1632)
m. María de Villegas alias de Rodas alias Gonzales (Espanola/mestizo) (b.????)
1.1.1.1.1 Ana Saavedra (b.1651)
1.1.1.1.2 Ines Saavedra (b.1653)
1.1.1.1.3 Juana Saavedra (b.1654)
1.1.1.1.4 Josepha Saavedra (b.1660)
1.1.1.1.5 María Saavedra (abt.1663?)
1.1.1.1.6 Juan Saavedra (b.1664)
1.1.1.1.7 Phelipe Saavedra (b.1664)
1.1.1.1.8 Santiago Saavedra (b.????)
1.1.1.2 María de Saavedra (Espanola) (b.1634) - Padrinos: Domingo Basques and María Basques
1.1.2 Isabel de Saavedra y Monroy (c1633)
m. Ines de Brenes y Mendoza (birth dates are again all over the map, usually c1610 to c1622)
Hola, everyone:
My name is Ryan and I am currently researching my 10th great-grandfather, Andrés de ARAIZA. I believe he was born around 1635 and he married Micaela de YSASI/ISASSI around 1655. Their children are: Catalina de ARAIZA (1658-?) and Antonio de ARAIZA (1661-?), both of whom were born in Ahualulco de Mercado, Jalisco. Andrés de ARAIZA died 4 Jul 1662 in Ahualulco de Mercado, Jalisco.
This WikiTree* says that Andrés de ARAIZA's parents were Juan de ARAIZA y MEDINA and María de las Islas, however I have not found any sources that support this.
*WikiTree: https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/De_Araiza-16
Has anyone come across my 10th great-grandfather, Andrés de ARAIZA, in their research and knows how he fits into the picture?
Siempre agradecido,
Ryan R.
¡Saludos a todos!
I am very excited to be joining this group. I live in California, USA, and I trace my ancestry back to the early Mexican settlers who came to California between 1769 and 1848. I am currently investigating my family's lines in Ahualulco, Jalisco.
Some of the families I am researching are: VÁSQUEZ, GÓMEZ, CORONA, DE ARAIZA, CORTÉS, DE YSASI/ISSASI, TIZNADO, ALVARÉZ, "CASTELO," RODRÍGUEZ, PATRÓN, DE LEÓN, DE HARO, PACHECO, DEL VALLE, DE SOTO, DE ÁVILA, ESPINOSA, LUGO.
I look forward to collaborating with everyone!
Atentamente,
- Rian R. (https://nuestrosranchos.org/rian)
Hello,
Thank you for allowing me to join this group. I am looking forward to learning from everyone here. I've been lurking for awhile now as a visitor reading public posts and am impressed by the knowledge and research of the members here.
Even though I've researched my Texas and American ancestors for a few years I'm a novice with Mexican genealogy. I have many questions and maybe a bit of original research to contribute, also.
I am researching families primarily in Jalisco and Guanajuato that are spread out like a wide curved paintbrush stroke from Aquascalientes southeast across Encarnación de Díaz and Lagos de Moreno through León and ending around Silao.
Surnames include (bold type indicates special interest): Gómez/Gómes, Tavares/Tabares, Pacheco, Carillo, Mena, Beloso/Veloso/Velas, Villegas, López de Lara, Padilla/Padilla de Ávila, Mezquita/Amesquita, Araisa/Araysa/Araiza, Quirós, Días/Díaz, Abrego, Sánches/Sánchez, Almaguer, Yañez, Ojeda, Hernández Ñagas, Saavedra, Mendoza, Santoyo, Santos, San Joseph, Luna y Tapía, Amador, Hernández/Hernándes/Hernándes de Aguila, Lópes/López, Chavarria, Martínez/Martín, Flores, de la Cruz, de los Reyes, Zamores/Samores, de Silva/de Silba, Medina, Espitia, Lovato/Lobato, Ximénes/Giménes/Jiménes, Espinosa/Espinoza, Gonzáles/González, Alonzo, Ortiz de Parada, Moreno, Gonzáles de Ruvalcava, Gallardo, Rodas, Balderrama/Valderrama/Gauderrama, Beserra/Becerra, Carrillo, Romo/Romo de Vivar, Macías, Baladés/Valadés, Lomelín, Ruiz de Esparza/Ruis de Esparsa, de la Cerda, de la Cerna, López de la Cerda, Báez/Báes/Váez/Vaz, Ysassi/Isassi/Ysas/Isasi, Rodrígues/Rodríguez, Ponse/Ponce/Ponze, Gutiérrez, Torres, Garnica, Cardoza/Cardosa, Cardona, Zamarripa/Samarripa, Cortéz/Cortés, Pichardo and de la Mota.
With multiple lines of descent from the following couples in the 1600's and 1700's:
Thanks again,
Travis
A new member (NA, T) asked if anyone in the group has, or is working on this. Also whether it would be good information to upload to the website (Not my area of research but I'd say YES, please do):
I am working on a transcription of the 1669 padron of the Villa de Santa María de los Lagos, with some genealogical notes on its individuals and family groups with some references to records (marriage, baptism and dispensas). I'm only on page 11 so far so it'll be awhile before I'm finished. Ultimately my intention is to cross-reference it with the 1676 padron. Also, I'm indexing the pueblos and ranchos in the 1808 padron (with brief notes on some ranches like chain of ownership, name changes, etc.).
Joseph Puentes
ps: just in case if you all see any Puente/Puentes/De La Puente in any of those records or Diaz too please bring them to my attention.
Hi everyone,
I'm trying to read another document from Francisco de Covarrubias, but I can't make out what the highlighted words say. Could someone take a look and let me know what the highlighted words say? I really appreciate it.
Estimados compañeros,
¿Alguno de ustedes tiene información que lleve a la localizaión del origen de Rodrigo de Pinedo, residente en Jerez y marido de Catalina Cid Caldera?
Agradeceré enormemente cualquier información al frespecto.
Un cordial saludo,
hfaizcorbe