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Are Sebastián Pérez & Lázaro Ramos half-brothers?

While doing text searches on FamilySearch, I discovered an interesting collection of documents concerning the relationship between Sebastián Pérez, Lázaro Ramos, and Juana Sánchez:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-XW95-88 (images 140–178)

The documents span the years 1709–1711 and center on the marriage of Lázaro Ramos and Juana Sánchez and the couple's relationship with Sebastián Pérez. Lázaro claimed to be the maternal half-brother of Sebastián Pérez—who was Juana's uncle by marriage as well as the father of her two children, Mateo and Magdalena.

I have read both the transcriptions and the original documents, but AI transcriptions are sloppy and the early 18th-century handwritten Spanish is challenging for me. I am struggling to fully understand the testimony.

The evidence presented in these testimonies is mostly hearsay and seems to be ambiguous.

Has anyone else studied this particular group of records? More specifically, does the testimony ultimately support the

Comments

Comment

Hi Travis,

Listed below is a translated excerpt from the book: "Genealogy of Nochistlán, Old Kingdom of New Galicia in the 17th Century according to its Parish Archives"

Chapter 80 covers several of the individuals that are involved in the documents noted in your original post.  Unfortunately this does not answer your question as to whether or not Sebastian Perez and Lazaro Ramos were half-brothers, but perhaps the below translated document may assist others in knowing the extent of this Perez family, including Sebastian Perez.   The translated and actual documents are both located in our File section, under the "Reference" area. The link:  Nochistlan Capitulo 80

Chapter 80, Start Page 231

Genealogy of Nochistlán, Old Kingdom of New Galicia in the 17th Century according to its Parish Archives

The Pérez de Frías / Pérez Burgeño / Pérez Espinoza of Santa María de los Lagos at the beginning of the 17th century

Descendants of Juan Pérez de Frías and María López

There is some doubt as to who the father of the offspring documented in this chapter is. According to the illustrious researcher Don José Alfonso Rodríguez de Carvajal y Ortiz, these are sons of Juan Pérez de Frías, son of Juan Pérez de Frías the Elder, brother by Hernando de Frías.  It is documented that Juan Pérez de Frías the Elder "In 1597 Juan Pérez de Frías received a siege of cattle (780 hectares) and a caballeria of land (43 hectares) bordering the town." p.21. Rojas, Beatriz et al., Brief History of Aguascalientes. 1994, El Colegio de México. Likewise, Juan Pérez de Frías is documented as selling land to the Orozco Agüero family in 1579 giving rise to the Ajojucar hacienda. (Guillermo Garmendía Leal, p. 121). Likewise, there is the Document dated June 15, 1577 concerning the Indians of Nochistlán to the Mayor MR of the valley of Suchulipa regarding bad treatments that mention sending Indians to serve Ju°de Frías Voice of the puo of Teocaltiche, State Public Library from Jalisco, No. 11, Leg. 1, 16th Century. Doña Ángela de Belasco, widow, wife of Gerónimo de Orosco, deceased, mentions who appeared before the notary Juan Pérez de Ribera, his son, Franco de Orosco, and presented a mrd Ssha for Mr. Don Gerónimo of Orosco, president and governor, and Cappan, general, who was from this R" to Ju Pérez de Frías, of a cattle ranch site smaller (438 hectares) and four caballeries of land (166 hectares in total) in terms of this town (Teocaltiche) in the Junta of the two rivers of Custique and the one they call the big one and up above, a hot spring in the river itself, and by the lower part a mustard. Its date in Guadalajara on October 20, 1579. These two documents were provided by the illustrious researcher Don José Alfonso Rodríguez de Carvajal y Ortiz. It is a fact that María Burgeño, Ana Pérez, and Sebastián Pérez are siblings, all born in the early 17th century. They need to be identified. The name Pérez de Frías is due to marriage records and the fact that Casilda is the daughter of Beatriz Pérez or Burgeño and granddaughter of Ana Pérez should have himself appointed from Frías. Likewise, Don José Alfonso Rodríguez de Carvajal y Ortiz mentions the possibility of the existence of a Sebastián Pérez de Frías. Initially, Jaime Holcombe mentions an unknown person with the surname Burgeño. He married María Rubio, possibly the daughter of Diego González and María Rubio, who had the following offspring (coinciding the first two): María Burgeño married to Juan López de Elizalde, Ana Burgeño married to Bartolomé Martín, Catalina Rubio married to Luis López Ramírez, N.N. married to Diego Pérez who died on July 12, 1629 and Francisco González born c. 1592. He then mentions that these offspring are the children of Juan Pérez de Frías and María López.  From the marriage the following three offspring have been documented:

1) María Burgeño or María López married to Juan López de Elizalde son of Juan López de Elizalde y Aberruza and Leonor Becerra and Sánchez de Mendoza, Chapter 81.

 2) Sebastián Pérez de Frías, who married Leonor de Rubalcava. On February 4, 1687, in Santa María de los Lagos, presented the dispensation of 3rd degree of consanguinity due to lawful copulation of Juan de Ornelas, a 40-year-old Spaniard, a natural and resident of said parish; to marry Leonor de Rubalcava, 48 years of age, widow of Sebastián Pérez, and daughter legitimate of Juan de Rubalcava and María López, where the claimant declared that María López, deceased, was his blood sister of Sebastián Pérez, husband of the said Leonor de Rubalcava, the intended bride, and the same María López, was Beatriz López's mother, and she was the mother of the said Juan de Ornelas, so that the said Sebastián Pérez was the carnal uncle of the Beatriz López, mother of the prospective groom. Sacred Mitre of Guadalajara, Records of the Series of Marriages - Extracts from the 17th and 18th Centuries, María de la Luz Montejano Hilton, Microfilm 167982-474. Rodrigo was a witness de Olivares, 44 years old, who said that Sebastián Pérez de Frías died 12 years ago, Francisco de Olivares, 37 years of age and Francisco Sánchez Moreno, 63 years of age (information provided by Mary Lou Montagna).

Possibly the same woman, Leonor González, wife of Juan Pérez de Ornelas, died on January 2, 1697.

The following three offspring have been documented from the marriage:

    a) Sebastián Pérez de Frías. On April 21, 1719, in Santa María de Los Lagos, the marriage information was presented.  Sebastián Pérez de Frías, 57 years old, son of Sebastián Pérez de Frías and Leonor de Rubalcava and widower of Josepha de Castañeda; to marry               María García, with Nicolás de Ornelas as witness, who says that the deceased Josepha de Castañeda was his aunt.

b) Marcos Pérez de Frías. On February 5, 1674, Marcos, son of Sebastian Pérez and Leonor, was baptized in Teocaltiche, hijo Sebastian Perez and Leonor Robalcava, with Diego Jiménez and María Ruiz as godparents, all Spaniards and residents of this jurisdiction.

End Page 231 

Start Page 232 (Chapter 80 - Continued)

Genealogy of Nochistlán, Old Kingdom of New Galicia in the 17th Century according to its Parish Archives

c) Inés de Rubalcava, legitimate daughter of Sebastián Pérez and Leonor de Rubalcava, who married Juan Ximénez on the 21st May 1716 in Santa María de los Lagos.

d) Juan Pérez de Ornelas. On August 9, 1707, Juan Pérez de Ornelas, a Spaniard, presented marriage information. Originally from and resident  of this parish in Río de Santa María, legitimate son of Sebastián Pérez de Ornelas and Leonor de Rubalcava, deceased; to marry Magdalena de Valdez, a Spanish widow of Joseph Carrillo and originally from Teocaltiche and a resident of this parish for six months, legitimate daughter of Basilio de Valdez and Catalina de Anda Altamirano.

3) Ana Pérez or Burgeño, who married Bartolomé Martín. On April 25, 1699, in Santa María de los Lagos, she was noted in a dispensation from a 4th degree of consanguinity for Sebastián Hernández, a 28-year-old Spanish citizen, resident and originally from said town legitimate son of Alonso Hernández and Juana de Araujo; to marry Josepha Pérez de Ornelas, a 20-year-old Spanish woman of age, legitimate daughter of Juan Pérez de Ornelas and Leonor de Rubalcava, deceased, residents of the parish, where she declared that Ana Pérez and María Burgeño were sisters and that Ana Pérez had a daughter named Beatriz Burgeño (Beatriz Burgeño or Pérez, who married Isidro de Araujo (Chapter 85), who had a daughter, Juana de Araujo, the claimant's mother, and the aforementioned María Burgeño had a daughter, Beatriz López, mother of Juan Pérez de Ornelas, father of the claimant. Sacred Mitre from Guadalajara, Marriage Records - Extracts from the 17th and 18th Centuries, María de la Luz Montejano Hilton, Microfilm 168604-2904. 

Bartolomé Martín married María Sánchez de Mendoza as his second wife, having descendants in San Juan de los Lagos according to the register of the Xalostotitlán district of 1650 (House of Bartolomé Martín, Spaniard who lives in the town of San Juan): Juan Garcia, his son of 28 anos, Lázaro de la Peña or Sánchez, a Spaniard who married Jerónima Chavarria, daughter of Juan Rodríguez de Chavarría and Beatriz de Retamosa, Joséph Sánchez de Mendoza who married D. Maria de Orozco and others children and grandchildren. The report of Fiscal proceedings of the Royal Court of Guadalajara of Santa María de los Lagos of May 10th 1612 which mentions: Diego Pérez, Bartolomé Martín and Juan López de Liçarci, his sons-in-law, indicating that at least Bartolomé Martin and Joan López de Liçarci are married to two sisters, Ana Pérez o Burgeño and María López de Elizalde respectively. Regarding another Bartolome Martin—or perhaps the same person or a relative—the following three pieces of information exist:  On December 27, 1589, in Aguascalients, Bartolome Martin married Cathalina de Espinoza, daughter of the public notary Francisco de Espinoza (a resident of Santa Maria de los Lagos who was still alive in 1605), with Rodrigo Munoz, Hernando de Villegas, Simon Galarca, and others serving as witnesses. They were veiled on March 6, 1590 in Santa María de los Lagos. On June 16, 1628, in St. Mary of the Lagos, Catalina, daughter of Bartholome Martin and Cathalina de Ortega, was baptized. with Madalena de Padilla and Don Lorenso de Padilla as godparents. On October 8, 1635, in Santa María de los Lagos, it was Bartolomé, son of Bartolomé Martín and Cathalina de Ortega, was baptized, with Pedro Gómez Portugal and his wife as godparents. Isabel Ortiz. On August 15, 1639, in Santa María de los Lagos, Nicolás, son of Bartolome Martin and of Cathalina de Ortega, his wife, and his godparents were Lieutenant Andrés López and his sister María González. From this marriage  the following four documented offspring:

a) Nicolás Martín. On March 27, 1619, Nicolás, son of Bartolomé Martín and Ana Burgeño, was baptized in Santa María de los Lagos, with Miguel Hernandez and Juana de Herrera as godparents.

b) Beatriz Burgeño who married Isidro de Araujo, Chapter 85.

c) María Burgeño. On May 3, 1663, in Santa María de los Lagos, Joseph de Espinosa, legitimate son of Francisco de Espinoza… de fernándes del pinal; with María Burgeño, legitimate daughter of Bartolomé Martín and Ana Péres, both deceased. His wedding sponsors were Ysidro de Cuebas (de Araujo) and Beatriz Burgeño, his wife. The census of this town of Santa Maria de los Lagos for the year 1669 mentions:

                 "Joseph de Espinoza / María de Burgeño, his wife"

d) Alfonso Pérez Burgeño. A possible son of this marriage is Alfonso Pérez Burgeño who married María de Mendoza. The following offspring has been documented from this marriage:

1) Ildefonso Pérez Burgeño. On February 12, 1663, Ildefonso was baptized in Santa María de los Lagos. (appeared to be seven months old) son of Alfonso Pérez Burgeño and María de Mendoza, natives of this. The parishioners of said town of Xalostotitlán were Ju' de Fuentes and Josepha Guttz, godparents.

4) Diego Pedro Pérez de Frías. Another possible son of this marriage is Diego Pérez de Frías: On July 9, 1656 in the Royal Court of Sierra de Pinos, Diego de Frías and Elena de Sotomayor (daughter of Juan Montañez and María de Sotomayor) were married. On

End Page 232 

Start Page 233 (Chapter 80 - Continued)

Genealogy of Nochistlán, Old Kingdom of New Galicia in the 17th Century according to its Parish Archives

José Luis Vázquez y Rodríguez de Frías

March 3, 1641, in Teocaltiche, Gerónima, daughter of Ju de Rubalcaba and Mari López, residents of the town of, was baptized in Teoqualtiche, with godparents Diego P° son of Ju° Péres de Frías and Mariana Lópes his sister (of Diego Pedro) residents of this village. 

The following eight offspring have been documented from this marriage:

a) Melchora de los Reyes y Pérez de Frías, who married José de Ornelas. Melchora was confirmed on December 29th of 1666 in Teocaltiche, with Francisca Sánchez as godmother. On June 22, 1708, Teocaltiche presented Matrimonial information Matiana Ruiz daughter of Antonio Ruiz (de la Fuente) and Mariana de Ullóa; to marry Luis de Ornelas, son of José de Ornelas and Melchora Pérez de Frías, where there was an impediment of consanguinity.   Jaime Holcombe presents the following hypothetical family tree (Private communication between Jaime Holcombe and Mary Lou Montagna).

Juan López de Elizalde y Becerra and María Burgueño

Mariana López

cc. Juan Pérez de Frías

1

Leonor López

cc. Juan de Sepúlveda

Diego Pérez de Frías

cc. Elena Sotomayor

2

Josefa de Sepúlveda

cc. Captain Peter de Ulloa y Marquez

Melchora Pérez de Frías

cc. José Ornelas

3

Mariana de Ulloa

cc. Antonio Ruiz

Luis de Ornelas

Groom

4

Matiana de Ulloa

Bride

Juan Pérez de Frías

cc. María López

1

Luis de Frías or Luis Delgadillo

cc. N.N., resident of Tototlán in 1631

After becoming a widower, he was ordained as a priest. He died on June 2, 1637 in Nochistlán.

Diego de Frías

cc. Elena de Sotomayor

Pinos, July 9, 1656

2

Diego Pérez Delgadillo or Pérez de Frías

cc. Catherine Cortés de Isla

Nochistlán, January 26, 1656

 

                         

 

                                                   

                                                                                                  |

 

 

The following six offspring have been documented from this marriage:

1) José de Ornelas. On October 17, 1681, in Teocaltiche, Luis de Ornelas was baptized. On December 16 in 1708 in Teocaltiche, marriage information was presented by Joseph de Ornelas, a 26-year-old Spaniard, son of Joseph de Ornelas and Melchora de los Reyes y Pérez Frías to marry María González de Rubalcava, daughter of Joseph Rubalcava, deceased, and Petra Díaz. The claimant declared that she has two children and is expecting another. Thus, it was also documented that the grandmother of the claimant and the grandmother of the claimant were sisters. Sacred Mitre of Guadalajara, Microfilm 168114. 

2) Bernardo de Ornelas who married Gabriela Sánchez Carrillo de Sandi, natural daughter of Ygnacio Carrillo de Sandi and Gertrudis Sánchez. On April 9, 1731, in Teocaltiche, Bernardo Ornelas 25 years old presented marriage information. Bernardo, son of Joseph de Ornelas and Melchora de los Reyes y Pérez, to marry Gabriela Sánchez Carrillo, 16 years of age, the natural daughter of Ignacio Carrillo de Sandi and Gertrudis Sánchez. The bride-to-be declares that... although her father would like to take her in, he is poor, has many children, and is married... and her mother has other daughters, all of whom are poor in the town of Aguascalientes and live outside this parish. It was also documented that Ignacio Carrillo was the son of Agustina Jiménez, daughter of Jacinta de las Roelas, sister of María de Sotomayor, mother of Elena de Sotomayor, mother of Melchora de los Reyes y Pérez. Sagra Mitra of Guadalajara, Microfilm 16814.

   3) Juan de Ornelas who married María González de Rubalcava daughter of Joseph González de Rubalcava and Petra Díaz.

End page 233 

Start Page 234 (Chapter 80 -

Comment

Hello Travis,

I have not found substantiating documents that confirm or deny that Lázaro Ramos is the illegitimate son of Leonor González de Ruvalcaba or the illegitimate son of Felipe de Ruvalcaba (Leonor's brother). The uncertain parentage continued into subsequent generations which we find in the 'dispensa' for Juan de Castañeda and Catarina Ortiz date 11 may 1720:

"México, Jalisco, registros parroquiales, 1590-2022," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-D2B5-K?cc=1874591&wc=3JW5-… : 28 July 2026), Guadalajara > Diócesis de Guadalajara > Matrimonios 1705-1720 > image 616 of 630; parroquias Católicas (Catholic Church parishes), Jalisco.

The groom, Juan de Castañeda, 'español' is "originario del puesto del Tecolote, feligresía del pueblo de Nuestra Señora de San Juan y criado desde muy niño en esta feligresía [de Santa María de los Lagos] en la labor de San José de la Mololoa", and the legitimate son of Juan de Castañeda (living at the time in 'la Estanzuela', feligresía de Teocaltiche) and María Burgueño Pérez, deceased.

The bride, Catarina Ortiz, 'mestiza', is "originaria y vecina de la cañada de Patricio", and the legitimate daughter of Cristóbal Ortiz and Juana de Aguirre, 'mestizos'.

The grooms petition is for "segundo con tercero grado o de tercero con cuarto grado que no se sabe ciertamente en el grado legítimo, que sea por ser por linea bastarda". The witnesses are:

  1. Sebastián Pérez, "español, vecino de esta feligresía en el puesto de San José de la Mololoa", 'tío carnal' of the groom and 'tío en segundo grado' of the bride, and 66 years old. This is the same Sebastián Pérez from the 1709-1711 documents that you referenced and who in this document also declares that Lázaro Ramos is his step brother, "...Lázaro Ramos, abuelo de la pretensa, y María Pérez Burgueño fueron hermanos..."
  2. Diego Pérez, "español, vecino de esta feligresía en el la labor de San José de la Mololoa", brother of Sebastián Pérez, and 48 years old. Diego references the proceedings against his brother Sebastián for an illicit affair (the aforementioned 1709-1711 documents) that based on what was said from those proceedings it was said that Lázaro Ramos is the illegitimate brother of said Sebastián Pérez and therefore his brother also, although he does not know this to be true nor does he recognize him as his brother -  "...y entonces se dijo que Lázaro Ramos, abuelo de la pretensa era hermano del dicho Sebastián Pérez y por el consiguiente, suyo del testigo por linea bastarda, que lo cierto no lo sabe ni que le ha reconocido por tal hermano...". Coincidentally, I am currently researching this Diego Pérez, who appears to be the same Diego who married Teresa Valero (or Ovalle).
  3. Felipe Pérez, "español, vecino de esta feligresía en el la labor de San José de la Mololoa", brother of Sebastián and Diego Pérez, 50 years old. In his testimony Felipe provides the basis for the alternate 'tercero con cuarto grado' relationship between the groom and bride, stating that he had heard his mother say that Lázaro Ramos was the son of Felipe de Ruvalcaba, his mother's brother and thus Felipe's first cousin  -  "...le oyo decir a su madre de este testigo que Lázaro Ramos, abuelo de la pretensa Catalina Ortiz, mestiza, como había sido hijo de Felipe de Ruvalcaba, hermano de la dicha su madre y que así se lo decía para que lo tuviera el testigo por su primo hermano..."

Lázaro Ramos also appears in the 1679 'padrón' of the parish of Jalostotitlán under the household of Diego Gómez (presumably the same "Don Diego" that you listed in your post):

Estancia: Diego Gómez, Isabel Barrona, Lázaro de Ramos, María Pérez, Andrés Gómez, María Gómez

Saludos,

Austin Pérez

 

 

 

Leonor Chávez Corona

Greetings, I've been looking for info and relationship with the Villaseñor of "Leonor Chávez Corona/Corona de Villaseñor" wife of Diego Ruiz de Cortés and mother of Andrés Ruiz de Chávez (founder of the Ruiz de Chávez lineage), Juan Ortiz Cortés (ancestor of Miguel Hidalgo and Morelos) and many others. Her grandchildren and later descendants regularly used the last name "Villaseñor" and "Corona" without having any other possible descent from those families other than through her. The use of Corona and Villaseñor together was first seen with the marriage of Juan de Villaseñor Cervantes (first male son of Juan de Villaseñor Orozco) and Catalina Corona. They had children in the decade of 1560s/1570s meaning that in order for Leonor to be a descendant of this marriage she'd have to be at best a granddaughter of these two (since she began to have children by c. 1600) but I have no knowledge of any children of theirs marrying someone with the last name "Chávez". If someone knows anything

Comments

Comment

Dear Daniel,

Your insight is fascinating, as always. I have long wondered about the claimed connection between the Ruiz de Chávez family and Hernán Cortés (aside from the Cortés line that suggests a link, of course). If this branch of the Chávez family indeed originates from Ciudad Rodrigo (Salamanca), there is a strong possibility they stem from the García de Chaves lineage, who were connected by marriage to the Orellana family, ancestors of Cortés himself.

Please do keep us updated as your research progresses.

Best regards,

Erik Andrés Reynoso y Márquez

Comment

Hello Erik,

Great to hear from you! Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this family. I find your suggestion that these Chavez might have a link to the Garcia de Chavez (plus the possible connection to the Orellana family) very fascinating and worth investigating further as time permits. I'll gladly share my findings as I go. 

For now, I'm stuck trying to decipher a very difficult (to me) paleography that mentions the names of Andres de Chavez parents (in his will): 

Mexico, Michoacán, Morelia, registros notariales; ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSKV-D9KL-D

Image
Andres de Chavez - Cabeza del testamento

I can make out the name of the mother, which I take it to be "...doña Maria de Chaves..."? The father's name is super difficult to read. I'm guessing it's either Pedro or Gonzalo - I can't make out the last name. "...vecinos que fueron del pueblo de sep(?)... jurisdicion de Ciudad Rodrigo de los Reynos de Castilla...". 

Further in the same documents, we see a carta de dote where Andres' parents are mentioned again and it's a slightly more legible:

Mexico, Michoacán, Morelia, registros notariales; ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSKV-D9K9-K

Image
Carta de dote

"...hijo legitimo de Pedro/Gonzalo (?) ... de maria de chaves su mujer naturales del pueblo de sepul(?) ... de la jurisdicion de ciudad rodrigo en espana..."

I still can't confirm/make out the parents names and the town that they were originally from that fell under the jurisdiction of Ciudad Rodrigo. If anyone is able to make it out, please let us know.

Thank You,

Daniel

Comment

Hello Daniel,

Thank you so much for sharing these important documents! That processional hand is certainly difficult, but I wanted to pass some of my thoughts about it.

The father’s surname actually differs slightly between the two images, the second one uses a chained notary shorthand. What initially looks like Ordás has a distinct B in the middle (matching the scribe's B in Bieren/vieren). Taking both folios together, the ductus points toward an Orbal-/Corbal-/Gorbal-root.

As a potential lead: I checked my database and found Hernando de Gorbalán (also known as Corbalán), a regidor of Ciudad Rodrigo who was tied to Saelices el Chico, Hinojosa de Duero, and Ciudad Rodrigo. In 1572, he and his brother Antonio de Corbalán de Saavedra (regidor of Astorga) filed a Probanza Ad Perpetuam Rei Memoriam of their nobility, citing their paternal grandparents Ginés de Gorbalán and Catalina Álvarez Barba. Here is some info about him: PARES | Archivos Españoles I am not entirely convinced this is the correct lineage so please take it with a grain of salt.

As for their origin, the text clearly starts with Sepul..., but since it's within the jurisdiction of Ciudad Rodrigo, it’s likely a local despoblado or micro-toponym rather than Sepúlveda.

Best regards,

Erik

In reply to by Erik Andrés Re…

Comment

Thank you, Erik, for taking the time to review the information and providing your expertise on what the last name could be of Andres' father. Thank you as well for sharing your findings on the possible relatives of Andres' father. I'll take a closer look at the information you shared to see if we can find out more about this family.

I sincerely appreciate your help and support with this! I'll let you know if I find any concrete leads on Andres' ancestry.

Best Wishes,

Daniel

Comment

I think it was an assumption made based on the availability of the documents at the time. I have to imagine that it was much more challenging in the past to do this kind of research as you had to travel to the archives in person. This is similar to the case where for a while it was thought that Catalina Corona cc Juan de Villasenor Cervantes was originally from Extremadura, Spain as detailed in the book "Los Nietos de Don Juan" by Davila Garibi. It's not a dig or criticism, it's just a matter of what material/records were accessible at the time. I find myself having to adjust old theories/conjectures as more information and documents become available.

Regards,


Daniel

Comment

Thank you for the additional information and context Pascual. This is very useful and tells me I'm on the right track. 

I'd like to share some clues on the ancestry of Leonor de Chavez Corona. There's a mention of a sale for some land that dates from the late 1500s where Diego Ruiz (El mozo) is mentioned in addition to his brother-in-law Andres de Chavez: 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C9BN-2QL3-D?i=202  

The relevant writing says: "...Ytem un instrumento simple de Diego Ruiz el moso en que declara por el que por cuanto Andres de Chavez su cuñado vendio al padre Melchor Hernandes Duarte una estancia de ganado mayor digo menor en el valle de Guaniqueo en terminos de Puruandiro, lindes con estancia del Colegio y Tumbio y estancia que al presente es de Francisco Magdaleno en la rivera del Rio que baja a la puente de Guaniqueo en que aprueba la dicha escritura que hizo Andres de Chavez su cuñado en una foja."

Let's suppose that this Diego Ruiz (el mozo) is Diego Ruiz Cortez (Son of Diego Ruiz Cortez and Elvira Hernandez de Rangel). Diego Ruiz Cortez was married to Leonor de Chavez Corona as we know. If Andres de Chavez was the brother of Leonor de Chavez Corona, there's now two Chavez Corona siblings we know about. 

In the mid 1500s Morelia, there was a couple by the names of Andres de Chavez cc Leonor Alvarez. Andres de Chavez' will is available for viewing here: 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSKV-D9K1-K?cat=olib%3…

In it we find that Andres de Chavez was born in Ciudad Rodrigo (En los reinos de Castilla) and he married twice, first with Leonor Alvarez and then with Catalina de Mondragon. (Andres de Chavez and Catalina de Mondragon never had any children) Andres de Chavez and Leonor Alvarez had the following children:

Pedro de Chavez Corona (Born around 1560)

Leonor de Chavez Corona

Andres de Chavez Corona

Mariana Corona y Chavez

There are further clues scattered about in land disputes, grants, notarial documents, dispensas etc. that make me believe that Leonor Alvarez was most likely Leonor Alvarez Corona, daughter of Hernando Gonzalez Corona cc Catalina Gonzalez (Originarios de Guadalacanal) and some of the first Spanish settlers of Michoacan. I believe Leonor Alvarez Corona cc Andres de Chavez to be the source of the "Corona" in the Chavez Corona and thus the Ruiz de Chavez Corona. I don't think that there was ever a direct connection to the Villasenor family in this branch of the Gonzalez/Alvarez Coronas. If anything, there would have been a Villasenor connection via Leonor Alvarez Corona's sister Mayor Gomez Corona who married Gonzalo Gomez y Gomez. They had a daughter named Catalina Gomez Corona who married Juan de Villasenor Cervantes.

Daniel 

 

Comment

You're right all evidence suggests that the same Leonor de Chávez Corona who married Diego Ruiz de Cortés is the one who was a daughter of Andrés de Chávez & Leonor Álvarez Corona. It is then uncertain why some sources cite her as "Corona de Villaseñor" perhaps she had a very close relationship with her cousin Catalina and her spouse Juan de Villaseñor and that's why she adopted that last name? If that's so then it's weird to see her descendants many generations away use the "Villaseñor" if they had no relationship whatsoever.

Maybe Maria de Abrego (2°) was indeed in some way a Villaseñor and since there had been a confusion between her and her aunt Maria de Abrego (1°), her lineage was pretty much overlooked and researchers just assumed that since her mother-in-law Leonor had the Corona last name she was a Villaseñor Corona or alternatively Corona Villaseñor and that's where the Villaseñor had come from, mistakes such as these were very common, for example many relationships that Gabriel Ibarrola in his famous book "Familias y casas de la vieja Valladolid" claimed to be true have been proven to be completely false.

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Hello Pascual,

I've looked at this family for a while. Like you said, I have never seen a Villasenor associated with Leonor de Chavez Corona cc Diego Ruiz Cortez. She's always mentioned as Leonor Corona/Leonor de Chavez Corona/Leonor de Chavez. We only start seeing the Villasenor appear in one branch of the Ruiz Cortez y Chavez Corona, that's of Andres Ruiz de Chavez cc Maria de Villasenor. There's an "informacion matrimonial" where a Maria de Villasenor is mentioned in relation to an Andres Ruiz de Chavez in 1657:

Mexico, Guanajuato, Catholic Church Records, 1519-1984; https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-KLSQ-4W?cc=1860831

In here we see that Floriana Cortez de Villasenor is getting married to Fernando Carrillo Altamirano (Viudo de Tomasina de Lira y Zayas). One of the witnesses in this information is "Domingo Cortez". He mentions in his testimony that he's the brother of Andres Ruiz de Chavez. This Domingo is quite possible the same one who married in Mexico City in 1635: Mexico, Distrito Federal, Catholic Church Records, 1514-1970; https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939D-DX93-V?cc=1615259&wc=3P8Q-6TL%3A122652201%2C132529401. Domingo was the son of Diego Ruiz and Leonor de Chavez Corona. This implies that the Andres Ruiz de Chavez mentioned here is the son of Diego Ruiz Cortez and Leonor de Chavez Corona.

Now, there's another witness, "Juan de Villasenor" who mentions he's the brother of Floriana. He gives his age of 27 years old. So he was born around 1630. With this Juan de Villasenor, we now know that there's at least two children of Andres Ruiz de Chavez and Maria de Villasenor who carried the "Villasenor" surname.

Going back to Andres Ruiz de Chavez, we see his signature here in the same "informacion matrimonial": Mexico, Guanajuato, Catholic Church Records, 1519-1984; https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-KLS3-LH?cc=1860831. Let's compare that signature to this one from a territorial dispute where there's an Andres Ruiz de Chavez:

Morelia. Voting Registers 1649

In my opinion, the signatures match. Furthermore, in this territorial dispute, it's mentioned that this Andres Ruiz de Chavez was the father of a Nicolas de Chavez Cortez and Maria de Abrego was the mother: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSKV-D91X-F?view=fullText&keywords=Andr%C3%A9s+Ru%C3%ADz&lang=en&groupId=M9Z2-X66

So, given this information... I think that the Corona Villasenor comes from this branch/generation of the Ruiz de Chavez Corona. Andres Ruiz de Chavez married to Maria de Abrego (sometimes, the Castilleja was included as she descended from the family of the great Calzonci). So did Andres marry twice? (once to Maria de Abrego and then to Maria de Villasenor? Or are we dealing with one Maria - sometimes referred to as Abrego and other times as Villasenor?) I think that Maria de Abrego and Maria de Villasenor are the same person. Let me share some clues of why I think this:

  1. Andres Ruiz de Chavez and Maria de Abrego had a son named Jose Corona who was married to Juana de Sanabria. We happen to have his will where he states that he's the son of Andres Ruiz de Chavez and Maria de Abrego: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSD2-PH3M?i=534&cat=623294
  2. In an informacion matrimonial for a daughter of Jose Corona and Juana de Sanabria, her given name is: Maria de Villasenor: Mexico, Michoacán, Catholic Church Records, 1555-1996; https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-KG9R-MW?cc=1883388&wc=3NTF-SP8%3A178285301%2C178658501%2C204006203
  3. In another informacion matrimonial for another daughter of Jose Corona and Juana de Sanabria, her given name is: Leonor Corona de Villasenor: Mexico, Guanajuato, Catholic Church Records, 1519-1984; https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-ZGSL-92?cc=1860831

This makes me think that we're dealing with a one and the same Maria de Abrego Castillieja... y... Villasenor. I don't have any information on her parents other than she was a descendant of the "Senores de Michoacan". 

I hope this helps. 

Daniel

 

 

 

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Hi, indeed, Maria de Villaseñor and Maria de Abrego y Castilleja are the same person. I, some time ago, had contacted via Facebook a genealogist by the name of "José Ayala Solis" who wrote a book on this couple by the name of "Las tierras del Rey", where he explained their origins, who their children were, their connections, lands, etc, etc. Since he in his own words "Checked the entire church archives of San Miguel Tarimbaro". 

Unfortunately I wasn't able to get the book but when I was discussing with him about a previously unknown daughter of Leonor de Chávez and Diego Ruiz de Cortés (Leonor Ruiz de Chávez who died in 1680 at the supposed age of 100 who some users had thought was her mother) after explaining me who she was, he sent me an image, where the relationships and places where her and all of her siblings and nephews (children of Andrés) lived, there he textually mentioned that Andrés de Chávez and Maria de Abrego lived in the "Hacienda de Cotzio" in today's town of Téjaro in Tarimbaro from 1623 to 1676 (until Andrés death). He also mentioned in an extended family group i'm in, that Maria de Abrego had passed between 1671 and 1673 meaning that they had been married for 56-58 years giving Andrés no time to have remarried.

Here's the link to the image: https://www.familysearch.org/fr/tree/sources/viewedit/WD4S-TMQ?context&…;

In that image Andrés mother, Leonor de Chávez, is mentioned as Leonor de Chávez Corona meaning that at least the "Corona" did indeed come from her. Other sources do mention her as Corona de Villaseñor, including a wikitree profile by Ruben Hernández who almost always relied exclusively on direct contemporary records but unfortunately I can't access wikitree and thus can't give the link because I had been checking the website without making an account and apparently they thought my ip address was that of a bot and I have been blocked from accessing the platform...

On Maria's origins she was a granddaughter of Beatriz de Castilleja and her second husband Pedro de Garfias, who her parents were is unclear, she is usually confused with her aunt who was also named Maria de Abrego y Castilleja who was born in c.1555 since she reported being 52 in 1607 making it impossible for both to be the same person and it has already been debunked. 

valladoliddispensas.com recent updates!

Hello All,

It's been a while since I last posted in this forum. For those who don't know me, I run a website called valladoliddispensas.com, which is similar to guadalajaradispensas.com. Its purpose is to index all of the matrimonial dispensation records (and other types of genealogical information) from the "Antiguo Obispado de Michoacán/Casa de Morelos" microfilm archive, which is available through familysearch.org. The "Antiguo Obispado de Michoacán" covered the modern-day states of Michoacán, San Luis Potosí, Guanajuato, and Colima, as well as parts of Jalisco and Guerrero.

I wanted to share a few quick updates on the features I've added to the site:

First, I've updated all of the indexes so that you can now click on an entry's page-number link and be taken directly to that page in the corresponding FamilySearch microfilm. This should (hopefully) speed up your research.

Second, I've added a feature that organizes all of the index entries by town. If you'd like to see every entry for

Comments

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Estimado Daniel,

Enhorabuena por tu estupenda labor y de corazón te doy gracias  por la facilidad que ofreces a los miembros del grupo y demás personas interesadas en la genealogía para efectuar investigaciones en el antiguo obispado de Michoacán.

Cordialmente,

Héctor Félix Aizcorbe

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Daniel, ¡muchas gracias! Este sitio ha sido un recurso invaluable que, con tus últimas mejoras, facilitar las investigaciónes de los documentos de los archivos del obispado de Valladolid.

Comment

Hello Daniel,

Thank you for the update and hard work you've placed into the Valladolid dispensas page. I've used it with success in the past and am grateful. 

Best,

Travis

In reply to by Travis

Comment

Glad to hear that it's been useful to you Travis! We're back to adding more indexes. I encourage you to keep checking back to see if you find any new clues to help you with your investigations. Thank you for your feedback!


Daniel

Martin Navarro de Gabay

We discovered my dad has some Basque DNA through a DNA test.  I was able to research his family line to Martin Navarro de Gabay who was from Pamplona, Navarre, Spain, which I believe is Basque country. I know he married Petronilla de Moctezuma, but not much else.  Why did he travel to New Spain? What did he do in Mexico once he settled there. Where did he settle? How did he hook up with Petronilla?  I know we may never know the answers to all these questions, but if anyone has any information about him, I would be most interested.  Thank you.

Victoria Hernandez Lopez

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Erik -

How exciting that you are preparing specialized English narrative editions. I would be very interested in accessing that when it is completed. Thanks for your response.

Victoria

In reply to by zepolvic48

Comment

Dear Victoria,

Discovering a connection to the Navarro de Gabadi and Moctezuma lineage is a remarkable piece of family history.

Because this volume is a highly specialized, primary-source reference work containing newly published archival discoveries, verified nobility proofs, and critical surname corrections, it is issued in its original research language.

However, we are preparing specialized English narrative editions detailing prominent New Spain families for our international audience. I wish you the very best in uncovering your family’s legacy.

Erik Andrés Reynoso y Márquez

Lord of Tejada.

María Crestina Macías Valadés in Calvillo, Aguascalientes

Looking for information about María Crestina Macías Valadés (Española), usually spelled Masias Balades, AKA Ximénes AKA Péres.

She was probably born in Aguascalientes about, or before, 1733 (guess based upon her children's dates of birth). She married José Santiago Rodríguez sometime before 1748.

She was mostly referred to as "Crestina Macias" but her surname was given in various records as "Masias Balades," "Peres" and "Ximénes." 

I cannot find a baptism record for her, so I've been looking through the Macías Valadés family to find marriages with anyone with the surnames Jiménez or Pérez without much luck. 

Any suggestions or info would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Travis

 

 

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Hey Rick!

Thank you for sending the references. 

Correcting a couple of errors on these entries:

José Santiago Rodríguez didn't die 10 Nov 1781. That's the date of the marriage of his son José Ylario to María Carrasco (our ancestors). He is mentioned as already deceased within the record. Prior to my discovery of his burial record (7 Dec 1769), this was the first mention of him as deceased in records, which may be why the author of this entry chose 10 Nov 1781 as his date of death. 

The family search ID also shows María Cristina Masías as deceased on 10 Nov 1781, but she's clearly still living in the same above-mentioned marriage record. I cannot find a burial record for her, but she seems to have passed away between 16 May 1789 (marriage of her son Pablo) and 12 Apr 1793 (MI of her son Ignacio).

All the information for the couple's children appears accurate - I'll check Santiago's baptismal info next. 

I appreciate your suggestions and advice. 

Thanks,

Travis

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Saludos Travis,

You’re welcome Travis.  Good catches on those corrections. I will be on the lookout for more leads.   I have lots of information on the Rodríguez de Frias so I will look through those records to see if I can find more information. 
 

Happy Fourth of July,
Rick A. Ricci 

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Santiago is married to Cristina Macias Valdez born about 1728 Tabasco Zacatecas. Death 10/Nov/1781 Calvino, Aguascalientes Mexico 

Santiago is the son of Domingo Maldonado.  Domingo is the son of Maria Rodriguez 

L5ZT-Q3R.  
Cristina Macis Valdez y Jimenez.



Thanks Travis,

Rick A. Ricci

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Santiago is married to Cristina Macias Valdez born about 1728 Tabasco Zacatecas. Death 10/Nov/1781 Calvino, Aguascalientes Mexico 

Santiago is the son of Domingo Maldonado son of Maria Rodriguez 

L5ZT-Q3R.  
Cristina Macis Valdez y Jimenez is his wife 



Thanks Travis,

Rick A. Ricci

Juan Rodriguez and María Josepha de la Cruz in Calvillo, Aguascalientes

Looking for information about José Santiago Rodríguez and his parents, Juan Rodríguez and María Josepha de la Cruz. 

José Santiago Rodríguez (Español) born about 1731 (a guess based upon his children's births). According to his burial record (7 Dec 1769), he was born in Zacatecas and is the son of Juan Rodríguez and María Josepha de la Cruz. 

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-6SJ9-JKC

i can only find him in records from the 1750s onwards. He is recorded as living in San Nicolas, Calvillo, Aguascalientes (recorded in Tabasco, Zacatecas at first) and then living in Barranca, Calvillo. 

Was he born in San Nicolas Hacienda, Calvillo, which was considered Zacatecas at the time? 

I cannot find much on Calvillo prior to the 1740s. 

One clue: some later descendants used the surname Rodríguez de Frías, but neither Santiago, nor his sons, used that surname. They are recorded as simply "Rodríguez."

Any suggestions are welcome.

Thank you

Travis

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Hello Rick!

Thank you for replying to my queries about Santiago Rodríguez and his wife Cristina Macías and offering good advice. 

I'm actually visiting Jalisco and Guanajuato right now.

When I return, I'll put all the suggestions you offered to good use.

Thank you, again! 

Travis

Comment

Hello Travis,

There is a Juan Rodríguez, (son of Anna Maria) marrying Rosa Maria De la Cruz (daughter of Josepha de la Cruz) in Guanajuato on 29/April/1715.  [https://www.familysearch.org/en/tree/pedigree/landscape/K6WW-XNJ]


Another thing to remember when researching people with the name Santiago is to also consider that Santiago and Diego are interchangeable.  Try looking for a Diego Rodríguez de Frias.

Good luck in your research,

Rick A. Ricci

Access to some of my research via Dropbox

Dropbox Access

After an absence of several years, I am slowly trying to return to genealogy.  (Emphasis on slowly.)  In the meantime I would like to share some research by giving you access to my Dropbox account.  Some of these files will be familiar (the Jaime Holcombe letters that Ophelia Marquez and I compiled in the 1990s;  the San Luis Potosi testament reports; my research of Juan Montanez, Maria de las Ruelas, Galvan de Rojas and others; the Christmas letters to my relatives where I "gifted" ancestors; etc.). There are also a few Family Group Sheets prepared pre-internet. It's a hodgepodge of data that may help someone.  Just click on the link below.

I ask one favor of you.  When you find an error (or two), please let me know.  Thanks,

Mary Lou Montagna

 https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/3ca9n3uuvrfvre3o5nh77/AFyduE5sdqyl-fruqx…

Help Reading Document Baut. Mitla, Oaxaca SERNA

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GGZ1-9F8H?view=index&c…

Film number #004239424 

a Baptism for My possible Serna of Aguascalientes ancestor .. in the Iglesia San Pablo, Mitla, Oaxaca

Entry  begining on 2nd line 

2nd veinte y Sinco dia de Dec. de mil Setecientos y Setenta 

3rd y dos  Bautize y puse los santo Oleos y Chris-

4th  ma a Manuela hija Lexitima de Fran Co Serna 

Next Page  ( unknown  )  y Maria  F ??? ( unknown )  P. P. Juan Lopes y Josepha de ( ?????? )  

Any help is appreciated. 

 

 

upload

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is there some place i can learn how to use it.. i have been playing around with it.. but i feel perhaps i need to download it and then copy paste to gemini

Also would i need the Pro version of Gemini .. Thanks 

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David,

While the request has already been fulfilled, I came here to add that if you have Gemini active in the same window where the image is, it will transcribe the writing for you. I've been using it for help with documents from 1400 and 1500 and has save me hours! It can transcribe a page in seconds, where the task is all but fruitless for me. 

Here's the result for your situation:

"En la Yglia. Parrochial. de Matatlan en siete dias del mes de Dic.re de mil setecientos y sesenta y dos a.s. Baptize solemnem.te a Lazaro Mariano hijo legitimo de Juan de la Serna, y Magdna Mendes fueron sus Padrinos Juanchin Bapt.a y Maria Manla. a quienes amoneste su oblig.on y espiritual parentesco: todos de naturaleza y vec. de dha Cavec.a y para q. conste lo firmo."

I then asked Gemini to translate it into "modern" English (you can do the same into Spanish):

"In the Parish Church of Matatlán, on the seventh day of the month of December, seventeen sixty-two, I solemnly baptized Lazaro Mariano, the legitimate son of Juan de la Serna and Magdalena Mendez. His godparents were Juanchín Baptista and María Manuela, whom I instructed regarding their obligations and spiritual kinship. All are natives and residents of this administrative center; and in witness whereof, I sign it."

Juan Francisco de los Reyes (Signature)

 

Good luck!

AG

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"En la iglesia de Santiago Matatlán, en veinticinco días de diciembre de mil setecientos setenta y dos años, bauticé y puse los santos óleos y crisma a Manuela, hija legítima de Francisco Serna...(next page)(In the margin: Manuela)...y María. Fueron los padrinos Juan López y Josefa, a quienes amonesté su obligación y espiritual parentesco; todos son naturales y vecinos de dicha cabecera, y para que conste, firmé. Agustín Tinoco."

New Member

Greetings, 

I began my genealogy journey several years back researching my maternal grandfather's line.  My grandfather's mother (my great-grandmother) is originally from Ciudad Guzman (dob 1874) and had the maiden name of "Aguallo." A dear uncle of mine (now departed) would tell me stories about her maiden name and how it was linked to a small town (Nochistlan).  

During the COVID shutdown I followed the "aguallo" line back to the mid 1750's in Ciudad Guzman (Zapotlan Grande).  I found records (baptisms, marriage and death) on Family Search belonging to the "aguallo" line.  The oldest direct relative I found in Ciudad Guzman was Jose Vizente Ferrer de Aguayo (married in 1779), originally from Nochistlan, per his IM (a kind soul/wikitree moderator found the unindexed IM).  Unfortunately, I hit a wall at the time and could not find any additional documents for Jose Vizente Ferrer (ie a baptism record).  His marriage registry and IM identify one Antonio Mergil/Margil de Aguayo as his

Comments

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Don’t give up on the line “Antonio de Aguayo (son of Joseph de Aguayo and Manuela de Aguilar) married to Maria "Camacho Hermocillo" (not Yanez).”

More research is needed on Maria CamachoHermosillo    She may be the same Maria that is named Yañez    More research is needed to find out if they are the same person    In my research I have found many people, especially woman during this time frame, to be using different surnames 


Good luck in your research,

Rick A. Ricci

Comment

Rick,

that thought had occurred to me but surnames are completely different and i didn't want to fall into some sort of confirmation bias.  perhaps i will search a bit more on camacho hermocillo to see if something jumps out.  

thanks for the insight.

Jerry Lopez

 

 

 

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Hello JL,

Welcome to this group! 

I'm a novice to Spanish Colonial genealogy, but I made a couple of reminder notes for myself from the info in your post. If I run into anything in the future that may assist you in your search, I'll reach out. 

Best of luck.

Travis

 

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Travis, 

thanks for the welcoming reply. 

Despite my current lack of advancement on the Aguayo line, it was been a personally rewarding endeavor searching through old records and learning how to read/interpret them.  

 

thanks again,

Jerry Lopez

Spain and the American Revolution

Does anyone in the group have any ancestors that were involved in Spain's role of assisting during the American Revolution?

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While I don’t have a direct ancestor who participated in the American Revolution, in a post from an earlier NR thread, a member revealed that the grandson of one of my ancestors (Bartolome Delgado, of Sierra de Pinos, Zacatecas) did participate. The link to the post can be found here (and includes a link to the poster’s source): https://www.nuestrosranchos.org/comment/30195#comment-30195

His entry says: Juan José Delgado. MPR:G, on 26 Nov 1775, widower of Josefa Leonarda Juarez and son of Juan Manuel Delgado of Sierra de Pinos and Matiana Contreras, married Ma Margarita Sanchez, daughter of Juan Bautista Sanchez and Juana Ma Diez. They [bur?] in in 1781.

That marriage took place in Nueva Ciudad Guerrero, Tamaulipas, just south of Laredo, TX. It doesn’t give any specifics of how he was involved, but the source given does give a list of Spaniards & New Spaniards who fought in the Revolution that can perhaps be helpful to you.

Saludos,
Manny Díez Hermosillo