Nuestros Ranchos Site

Joseph, Nadine and I just had a conversation about boundary changes 
recently.  Yes, it is very likely that Colotlan was in the Zacatecas 
diocese in earlier times.  As for whether or not the records are now 
stored in the Guadalajara archdiocese.  I'll have to ask Nadine to 
see if she knows.  Her line is busy right now...
As for the 2nd question, I think I can answer that one. I have looked 
at a few of those films and the reason some years appear to be 
duplicated is that the original books had lose pages and many of them 
are out of order.  They appear to have been microfilmed exactly as 
they were found.  I think you'll find that for example Jan-Feb 1685 
will be in one film, March-June in another, etc. but not duplicated.

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes  wrote:
> 
> Wow she sounds like a wonderfully experienced in Genealogy 
person. . .
> 
> Can you ask her some questions for me?
> 
> 1) Colotlan's records keep saying from the diocese of

Luz has helped me for free on several occasions, going so far as to tell me
what cities my clan could be found in a particular generation and offering
historical information about Jalisco and Zacatecas. She does charge for
specific family research, however, and I have not yet used her services for
this purpose. A couple of years ago she was excited to message with me
for free, offering lots of advice, but my Spanish is slow and inadequate.

_________________________________________________________________

The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
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se habla español aqui, but professional genealogist usually ='s $$$$

Now mind you that later in about 10 years after I've finally come to my
first brickwall I might be willing to part with some schecals but not
just yet.

Do you think she'd be willing to send the group some general tips to get
us newbies going? GRATIS?

what does she charge by the way?

thanks,

joseph

Send me her email address and I'll send her an invitation to join the
group in Spanish.

Evie Villegas wrote:

Luz Montejano of Mexico City has been a professional genealogist for 20
years and her area of expertise is Jalisco and Zacatecas. She is especially
helpful with historical issues as she knows which families lived in a
particular area at a particular time. She corresponds in Spanish only.

Luz Montejano of Mexico City has been a professional genealogist for 20
years and her area of expertise is Jalisco and Zacatecas. She is especially
helpful with historical issues as she knows which families lived in a
particular area at a particular time. She corresponds in Spanish only.

_________________________________________________________________

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Janie wrote:

My great-grandparents were:

Teodoro Rosales (dob: ? place of birth ? ) and Tomasita Villegas
(dob: ? Place of birth ? )

One of their children was:
1) Porfiria Rosales (my grandmother), dob: 9-16-1905 place of birth
Zacatecas,

I guess they don't know where in Zacatecas right? Do they remember
anything at all like if it was close to Jalisco or Northern Zacatecas or
close to Durango or possible close to the capital, Zacatecas, Zacatecas?
Ask again and see if they remember anything else. Sometime when you
interview someone they will not remember anything when asked a direct
question so maybe the story approach would work. Maybe asking then stuff
like tell me about what Bis Abuelita Tomasita did in Mexico. Get them
going on some story about her life and maybe the story they are telling
will trigger some tidbit about location. Or maybe get them going on some
story about how Abuela Porfiria did this or that. Ask if its okay to
tape the conversation so you

Que bueno Dios sabe que yo necesito ayuda a veses. . .entre los dos
puedemos ayudar a los que necesitan ayuda.

joseph

readysetgo95814 wrote:

Yo también hablo y escribo Español para los que necesiten ayuda con
la traducción de cualquier mensaje.

Maria



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Wow she sounds like a wonderfully experienced in Genealogy person. . .



Can you ask her some questions for me?



1) Colotlan's records keep saying from the diocese of Zacatecas. I don't
get this since its my understanding that it is the diocese of Guadalajara.
Could this possibly mean that it used to be of Zacatecas and now is of Guadalajara?
Or that in the days when the boundarys for the Estados were different so
was the diocese? If it used to be of Zacatecas and now is of Guadalajara
would the diocese records would they have been moved to Guadalajara or is
it possible that they are still hidden away in Zacatecas someplace?



2) Also I was hoping she might give me some thoughts on the duplications
of years covered in certain films from Guadalajara. For example there are
some single years that are covered by 4 different films. Also there are some
films that cover the same time periods: for example lets say your looking
for the 1685 time period. In this short list of the over 700 films

Joseph,
I think your idea is a good one.  Some suggestions I would make: 
don't add information that can be found somewhere else (for example 
the source list of films for a particular region off the LDS catalog 
could be added as a link instead).  The link would take up a lot less 
space and when the LDS catalog is updated our list would be out of 
date.  The ancestry reports can be exported to .rtf (rich text 
format) extensions.  rtf files take up less space than word documents 
and are compatible with more applications than are word documents.  
You also don't have to worry about members not being able to access a 
word document because they are running an older version of Word or 
don't have Word at all.

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes  wrote:
> 
> So far I love this group. It seems in time as we all get things 
sorted 
> out and we see who everyone is looking for we will kind of keep an 
eye 
> out for the various relatives we're looking for. If

Another person who can help the group with dispensas is my friend, 
Nadine Vásquez.  Unfortunately, I can't ask her to join the group 
because she doesn't use a computer.  However, she co-authored a book 
on Dispensas Matrimoniales and is a wealth of information on that 
subject and Mexican genealogy in general.  She's been doing genealogy 
research since 1964.

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Roberta"  wrote:
> Joseph - I'll email Steven Hernandez and invite him to join
> our group.  He has explained a couple of my gggrandmother/father's
> marriage certificates (with dispensas) (it seems as though all of my
> relatives were
> either 2nd 3rd or 4th cousins when they married). 
> I'll let you know what he says - apparently Steven has a lot of 
geneology
> information in the Los Altos area of Jalisco.
>  
> Roberta
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joseph Puentes [mailto:makas@n...]
> Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 10:28 AM
> To: LosRanchos
> Subject: [ranchos]

Yo también hablo y escribo Español para los que necesiten ayuda con 
la traducción de cualquier mensaje.

Maria

My great-grandparents were:
Teodoro Rosales (dob: ? place of birth ? ) and Tomasita Villegas 
(dob: ? Place of birth ? ) 

One of their children was: 
1) Porfiria Rosales (my grandmother), dob: 9-16-1905 place of birth 
Zacatecas, died 6-26-1986 in Corpus Christi,Tx. buried in Gregory,Tx. 
Porfiria married Rosendo Montes (dob: 3-1-1885 Place of 
birth:possibly Brownsville,Tx. Died 4-26-1966 in Corpus Christi,Tx 
buried in Gregory Tx. Son of Desiderio Montes d.o.b.? d.o.d.? 
marriage date? place of birth ? and Francisca ? d.o.b.? d.o.d.? place 
of birth ?

I have interviewed my mother and aunts all they remember was they 
called Tomasita "Ama Tomasita". They aren't even sure if Rosendo was 
born in Brownsville or in Mx. But they do know he was raised in 
Brownsville,Tx. Without someone reconnizing these names I feel thats 
as far as I can go on my mothers side of the family, on both her 
father and mothers side


Yes I use the LDS Family 
Search page for my research? 
As for FHC's? no I

So far I love this group. It seems in time as we all get things sorted
out and we see who everyone is looking for we will kind of keep an eye
out for the various relatives we're looking for. If nothing else its a
start.

But at this time the 20 megabytes we're allowed in the files section is
at 13 megabytes used. that means we'll be out of room in that area soon.

I know I can trim some of the stuff in there but that won't amount to much.

I was thinking that some of that stuff could be put on some of these
free websites that you can get. Then we could just put a link to the
various peoples genealogy lines. Maybe if you all have unused website
space you could put your personal genealogy info on it and then we can
just link to that section. . .

. . .I don't know

thats why I'm writing. Do any of you all have any ideas. Its just that
I'm thinking that maybe we might get another 5, 10 or even 20 more
people to join and once everybody puts there info in we'll be way over
t

Every serious hispanic genealogy researcher needs to own a copy of this book.
. .hey what do I know there very well could be and probably are better books
out there, but this book it pretty dog gone good. . .I mean GOOD!



it goes into a lot of details about baptism marriage death and other documents
we are using. It gives great key words and phrases found in them and helps
to abstract the information from them.



I've put the Matrimonio Dispensas section in the files section and also the
Table of Contents to the book.



joseph



ps: to answer you directly sometimes they are in the Matrimonio Informacion
films or you might have to get films from the Diocese. . .Guadalajara.



got more questions please ask. . .hey I probably won't know the answer but
that will provide the motivation to look for the answer.





aajay1073 wrote:

Joseph,

What is a Matrimonio Dispensas and where can I look one up at?  I 
found a couple's marriage information and within it, it was indicated 
that they were

From: Joseph Puentes 
Reply-To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
To: LosRanchos 
Subject: [ranchos] Hi Evie---?Villegas Connection???
Date: Fri, 21 Mar 2003 02:15:22 -0500

Hi Joseph, Juan Jose Leanos was married to Tomasa Amaya. I looked at
Josefa Leanos' marriage certificate once again. Sorry that I haven't
located Juan's marriage certificate yet. Although Guillermo Villegas who
married Josefa Leanos was born in Colotlan, his marriage took place in
Tabasco, Zacatecas.

_________________________________________________________________

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-----Original Message-----
From: Roberta
[mailto:roberta@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2003 12:01
PM
To: ranchos

Joseph,

What is a Matrimonio Dispensas and where can I look one up at?  I 
found a couple's marriage information and within it, it was indicated 
that they were blood relations.  Where could I look up a Matrimonio 
Dispensas for this couple?

Thanks,
Angie

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, Joseph Puentes  wrote:
> 
> Today I found the parents of my GGG grandparents: Felipe Santa 
Maria y 
> Benita Miranda in Tepetongo, Zacatecas.
> 
> Felipe's parents were: Jose Salome Santa Maria y Maria Francisca 
Ortiz
> 
> Benita's parents were: Gabriel de Miranda y Maria Nicolasa Miranda
> 
> Well this last couple brings up a good point: Matrimonio Dispensas
> 
> If this couple were possibly related and needed special permission 
to 
> get married it is possible for up to 4 generations of their 
genealogy to 
> be waiting in a "Matrimonio Dispensa" So since this is in the late 
> 1700's when this couple got married its possible with one record to 
> maybe get shotputted right back into

What surnames is Steve Hernandez researched/researching???  Yes, any
knowledge he can provide, I'm all ears!!!!!

Carol

Joseph Puentes wrote:

 

Let me suggest that he either join outright or just possibly be willing
to occasionally send us a lesson via email. I understand he must be tremendously
busy so joining might not be appealing to him but if we could just catch
a bit of knowledge and information here and there and I'm sure we'll all
see benefit. Thanks Roberta,

joseph

Roberta wrote:

Joseph
- I'll email Steven Hernandez and invite him to joinour
group.  He has explained a couple of my gggrandmother/father'smarriage
certificates (with dispensas) (it seems as though all of my relatives wereeither
2nd 3rd or 4th cousins when they married). I'll
let you know what he says - apparently Steven has a lot of geneologyinformation
in the Los Altos area of Jalisco.Roberta

-----Original
Message-----

From: Joseph Puentes [mailto:makas@...]

Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003
10:28 AM

To: LosRancho

Joseph, that is great that you found this record, what a find....I think
some answers for me also lie in Tepetongo in the mid 1700's.  I'm
going to study my research log and probably order some films from that
area.  I found that Vital baptized a child in Tepetongo but also in
SM and Cololtan.  It would be interesting to find out why they moved
around so much back in those days, possibly their occupation, way of life.
I'm going to check through all those batch numbers that you sent me for
these films first for Tepetongo.

Carol

Joseph Puentes wrote:

 

Today I found the parents of my GGG grandparents: Felipe Santa
Maria y

Benita Miranda in Tepetongo, Zacatecas.

Felipe's parents were: Jose Salome Santa Maria y Maria Francisca
Ortiz

Benita's parents were: Gabriel de Miranda y Maria Nicolasa Miranda

Well this last couple brings up a good point: Matrimonio Dispensas

If this couple were possibly related and needed special permission
to

get married it is possible for up to 4 generations

-----Original Message-----
From: Carol Turner
[mailto:cdian@...]
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 11:19
AM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ranchos]
CapitanLazaroMartinDelCampo_Gif File/INFO Request

What
surnames is Steve Hernandez researched/researching???  Yes, any knowledge
he can provide, I'm all ears!!!!!

Carol

Joseph Puentes wrote:

Let me suggest that he either join outright or
just possibly be willing to occasionally send us a lesson via email. I
understand he must be tremendously busy so joining might not be appealing to
him but if we could just catch a bit of knowledge and information here and
there and I'm sure we'll all see benefit. Thanks Roberta,

joseph

Roberta wrote:

Joseph - I'll email Steven
Hernandez and invite him to joinour group.  He has explained a couple of my
gggrandmother/father

-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Puentes
[mailto:makas@...]
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 10:59
AM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [ranchos]
CapitanLazaroMartinDelCampo_Gif File/INFO Request

Let
me suggest that he either join outright or just possibly be willing to
occasionally send us a lesson via email. I understand he must be tremendously
busy so joining might not be appealing to him but if we could just catch a bit
of knowledge and information here and there and I'm sure we'll all see
benefit. Thanks Roberta,

joseph

Roberta wrote:

Joseph - I'll email Steven Hernandez and invite him to
join

our group.  He has explained a couple of my
gggrandmother/father's

marriage certificates (with dispensas) (it seems as though all
of my relatives were

either 2nd 3rd or 4th cousins when they married). 

I'll let you know what he says -

Let me suggest that he either join outright or just possibly be willing to
occasionally send us a lesson via email. I understand he must be tremendously
busy so joining might not be appealing to him but if we could just catch
a bit of knowledge and information here and there and I'm sure we'll all
see benefit. Thanks Roberta,



joseph



Roberta wrote:

Joseph - I'll email Steven Hernandez and invite him to join

our group.  He has explained a couple of my gggrandmother/father's

marriage certificates (with dispensas) (it seems as though
all of my relatives were

either 2nd 3rd or 4th cousins when they married). 

I'll let you know what he says - apparently Steven has a
lot of geneology

information in the Los Altos area of Jalisco.

 

Roberta

-----Original Message-----

From: Joseph Puentes [mailto:makas@...]

Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 10:28 AM

To: LosRanchos

Subject: [ranchos]

-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Puentes
[mailto:makas@...]
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 10:28
AM
To: LosRanchos
Subject: [ranchos]
CapitanLazaroMartinDelCampo_Gif File/INFO
Request

I hope this works but I'm converting the
file sent in Tif format to Gif
format. I hope that those of you having
trouble opening the file will
now be able to. I'm not sure this is going
to work. . .we'll see.

joseph

ps: Roberta. I was wondering if
you could transcribe what is in the
bottom left corner about the
Matrimonio Dispensas and give us all a
little lesson on what this is all

Si hay alguien en el grupo que necesita unos de los mensajes traducidos
yo puedo hacer la lucha.

mi español no es muy bueno pero con tiempo puedo hacerlo.

joseph

================

If anyone in the group needs some of the messages translated I can give
it a try.

my spanish is not very good but with a little time I can do it.

joseph

I hope this works but I'm converting the file sent in Tif format to Gif
format. I hope that those of you having trouble opening the file will
now be able to. I'm not sure this is going to work. . .we'll see.

joseph

ps: Roberta. I was wondering if you could transcribe what is in the
bottom left corner about the Matrimonio Dispensas and give us all a
little lesson on what this is all about. Its such a wonderful source of
info when it can be found. Can you type it out so we can read that
section better and then give us a few words? thanks.

hey Maybe you can convince your Cousin Steven Hernandez to send us a all
a lesson about how he has used the Matrimonio Dispensas in his genealogy
work. We all could only hope to one day achieve a small portion of what
he has found in his genealogy.

Welcome to the group.

thanks for telling us your genealogy. there are a couple of people here
working on Villegas but I don't know if their Villegas are the same as
your Villegas.

So here's what I'm understanding:

your great grand parents are:

Teodoro Rosales (dob: _____ place of birth______) and Tomasita Villegas
(dob: ________ Place of birth ______)

children:

1) Porfiria Rosales (dob:_____ place of birth _____) married Rosendo
Montes (dob:______ Place of birth:_______)

try to give just a little more information so we can see if they are
from the same areas of Jalisco or Zacatecas that we are researching.
Especially the place of birth. We can kind of guess the dates of birth
some time in the mid to late 1800's but the place of birth is important.
Sometimes all the Villegas from certain little Ranchos were "ALL" related.

Also do you have any place and dates of death for the great grandparents
(if this applies)? Any places of marriage? Do you use the LDS Family
S